Joe Quattrone 00:33
Alright guys, we just wrapped up with Nico Lagen. He is a little bit of a lightning rod for conversation. Quick disclosure for audience members of the pod. Nico’s views and opinions are his views and opinions. They don’t necessarily reflect the members of this podcast. We’re trying to bring safe conversations around substance abuse and alcohol abuse to this pod pods audience. And people like Nico, who have very opinionated thoughts around masculinity as you know, they definitely suffer from some of the same things. So we wanted to give him a forum. But boys, what’s, what went on on this podcast? What can our audience expect from Nico?

JM Guthrie 01:13
Yeah, I got deep there for a minute, I was waiting for my dad to join to dive into this sort of really religious conversation that it went into for a minute. But in all seriousness, I think what I heard through everything that Nico had to say is how important it is to have fellowship with other people, and to have people that you can relate to but also lean on in times of trials and tribulations. And additionally, the need as a dad, to stand up for my kids and for my wife. And for those around me. There’s a lot to be said for that, maybe I would say it a little bit differently, or with a little bit different context, but certainly, I think it really aligned to a lot of what we talk about on a weekly basis on this show. So that was an interesting conversation and certainly a different angle on it, then we’ve had a lot more talk about Trump, too. Right. You UK? Why? Yeah.

Kary Youman 02:09
I mean, I think at the end of the day, I think talking to Nico was just a testimony to the inclusivity that this show is all about, you know, doesn’t matter where you come from, what you’re into who you vote for, we really want to open up this platform and just let people know that there is a space for you to talk about your mute total journey. So I think if nothing else, if people are willing to come into this with an open mind, I think I think they’ll take something from it. Yeah,

JM Guthrie 02:33
I think the other thing that I’ll add, we’re all different to right, like we come at this differently. And I think you’ll see that in all the shows, and certainly maybe see that even more on this one. So I think that’s a cool part of why we get along so well and jive the way we do on this buzzy ish podcast and

Joe Quattrone 02:49
sin and kind of the sentiment that I really pulled out of it. Is that similar to, you know, us as podcast hosts, we don’t need to be competing with one another to get our voice heard. As is relationship health, the difference between men and women is allowed to exist. But as husbands and wives or boyfriends and girlfriends or same sex partners or whoever you are, we don’t always have to compete with each other. I think the absence of teamwork in modern society, is to me the underlying reason why we have both toxic masculinity and toxic femininity is that people of all genders and races and creeds are struggling for power. And you know, I would just put it out there that we need more teamwork in society. And I hope that comes through in this episode because I think we were able to stand firm and stand tall with somebody that we don’t necessarily agree with on all topics. And we ended the podcast just fine. Nobody was shouting at each other and everybody’s gonna go about their way and that’s perfectly fine. Featured in Times Square, Nico Legon is an entrepreneur, men’s coach and host of the controversial podcast the Nikko Legon show. Growing up Nikko didn’t have a masculine figure in his life without the guidance he associated with idolizing the wrong men. Before making the shift to who he is now. He lived the life of an addict and drug dealer. After spending more than a decade on the wrong path working a nine to five he didn’t love. He realized how many others in the world are just like him and need someone to step in and fight for them. Masculinity is under attack in today’s society and Nico fearlessly champions strong men, although others might see Nico’s content as blunt and unapologetic and controversial. It brings back the fundamentals when men were allowed to be men. What was once a standard way of living is somehow now villainized. As a leader in today’s society, Nico has been featured on many online publications and podcasts that have hundreds of millions of views in Times Square in New York City, and it’s just the beginning. He’s a published author, with works such as “How following your personal legend is the answer to your midlife crisis, which is aimed at men between the ages of 30 and 45, who already possess the full virtues of a good man, provider, protector, courageous temperance and faith. Now facing an existential crisis referred to many as the midlife crisis, these men are realizing that they are one day going to die. Until that day, Niko will be fighting for all men to reclaim their manliness until his very less burnt last breath. Whether that means getting canceled or banned, Nico’s ready to do what’s right. I’ve listened to a little bit of your show, I listened to you on militant grind. And, uh, you were on that show a while back. So I’m really interested in your background. I know you grew up in a kind of fatherless household. And you dealt with dealing drugs and doing drugs. And I know your mom kind of pulled you back into, you know, better living and gave you a roof over your head and kind of gave you a reset button. But talk to us a little bit about those early days, I want to get into like your involvement and how you interacted with drugs and alcohol back in the day.

Nico Lagan 05:54
You know, it’s interesting, because you’re my dad did leave when I was 14 years old. But even prior to that, I can’t remember him really being around. And I love philosophy, right? So I’ve always been asking this question like, I’ve been asking myself for about a year now what’s worse, having a father that’s not present or having a father that’s completely absent?

Joe Quattrone 06:15
That’s a good question. I wouldn’t know because my father is still a very active farmer. So my guess is that, you know, the more of your father you can have as a present, the better. But I don’t know if they’re, if there’s a difference between not having them around at all, or having them around, but barely. So

Nico Lagan 06:32
I don’t think anybody can because most people don’t experience both right? There’s not really a way and I was too young to remember. But it’s interesting that within a year of him leaving, even if he wasn’t present, I was dropping out of school, I was doing drugs every day, I was turning into an alcoholic, I was associating with all the wrong people. Within a couple of years, I was selling drugs. My drug selling was to support my habit. It wasn’t to make me rich. I wasn’t that smart. Right. So it was just interesting that as soon as there’s a father figure that leaves like, I think it’s Steve Harvey that says that when father leaves they leave us they leave a hole in their shape and the soul of their son. So there’s always a gap there. There’s always something that needs to be filled. And by nature, men look for people to look up to, we’re always looking for people to mold or sell faster. And once you understand that, boys are born, but men are made through trials and tribulation, like we it’s always about what we bring to the table. It’s always about what we’ve become. It’s always about what we can give to others. We’re meant to serve, we’re meant to protect, we’re meant to provide. And it’s in our DNA. Like I didn’t understand this when I was 14 years old. All the guys I looked up to were all idols back then. I was listening to Wu Tang Clan on NAS, I was listening to some Mobb Deep. I was listening to gangster rap, right? Like I don’t come. I come from a poor family. And I looked at those guys. I’m like, Man, those guys are way shittier than I am. And look at what they have, they have women, they have cars, they have money. They party all the time. I’m like, yo, that’s a good man right there. Well, what the hell did I know? 14 years old? What the hell I thought I’d be the first white rapper. And you know, now I laugh at this, but that was before Eminem ever appeared. So technically, I could have technically I could have but yeah, I don’t have anywhere near the skills that each song is like we were not we’re not even playing the same sport at that point. But yeah, that lasted. I think, you know, I left my mom. My father left. I was 14. I was a dropout by a bicycle by 15. By 17. I was leaving my mom’s house and by then I was an alcoholic. I was drinking every day I was doing drugs. I was selling drugs. I was a thief. I was just not a good person. Like deep down like all around I was not a good person. And this lasted for another three years. I was 20 When my mom gave me a call. It seems like Joey already knows the story. It’s kind of strange. I don’t have to explain it. I guess I’ve been repeating this so many times that people give me a hard time but yeah, you know what I find interesting about this and I don’t know if I talked about it on militant grind, but I don’t have a very good relationship with my mother like I do to this day. We don’t talk like I do. I think the last time I spoke to my mother was probably Christmas last year. Like it’s her birthday. So I called her but she didn’t even call me for my birthday. That’s like a little text like Happy Birthday and Powell that’s the relationship I have with her. And, and it’s strange because we always like that we’re extremely different. Like she’s very, very left Sue’s very victim mentality. Like everything happens to her. She doesn’t cause any of her problems. It’s everybody around her. That’s the problem and You know, we never, we’ve always had difficulty speaking because we’re so different that but somehow that, you know, somehow she gave me a call when I was at my worse when I was getting kicked out of my apartment for like the third time and for years, I was contemplating, I had an opportunity to start producing drugs instead of selling it. So literally, I could, I could have continued down the rabbit hole. But I needed a time like I was getting evicted, I had no place to go, I’m literally my boxes are on the floor next to me. And I’m like, What the hell? Where the hell am I going? I’m becoming homeless that night. And somehow my mother calls me and she’s being polite. She’s not trying to make me feel bad about the situation. Like she’s not trying to tell me that what I’m doing is wrong. She’s really just being nice. So I really believe to the core of my being that God reached, somehow used my mother as a puppet and just like, let’s like, I can imagine God like, let’s go, let’s let’s, let’s call him and yeah, that’s what happened. She just asked me if I was happy. Which doesn’t sound like a great question, right? When you’re when I asked you right now, are you happy? No, whatever, I’m okay. But when you’re in a place of hurt, when you’re hitting rock bottom, you don’t know what comes next. And somebody asks you if you’re happy, it’s, it can be a challenging question. As simple as it is. And she then asked me, if you’re not, you then told me if you’re not, I’ll come back, though I don’t have money to pay for anything. But if you want a place to stick and give you a roof, you’re going to need to work, you’re going to need to go back to school, you’re going to do something because it’s not true. You’re going to sit here and continue doing what you’re doing right now. And that same night, I moved back.

Joe Quattrone 11:51
Wow. credible story. Now, there’s obviously been a couple decades since that past, I believe. You’ve been, you’ve been hard at work, really trying to inspire people. Tell us a little bit more about how you fell into, you know, wanting to give back to young men and why young men specifically, is there anybody that inspired this journey for

Nico Lagan 12:16
you? Not really, it’s it’s

Joe Quattrone 12:19
just like an absence of that in your life that made Oh, for sure. Oh,

Nico Lagan 12:23
yeah, for sure. That’s where it started. If it wasn’t for the fact that my dad left when I was 14 years old, I wouldn’t be speaking about what I wouldn’t be doing right now. I wouldn’t be speaking about this every day. If it wasn’t for the fact that I was raised by a single mother, I wouldn’t be writing a book on giving the tools to single mothers on how to build the five virtues of a good man wielding young men, right? None of what I do today would be happening. If it wasn’t for that it’s from my dad leaving that kind of sent me on a path of you know, I strongly believe God will challenge you, I strongly believe that God will test you, I strongly believe that he will put you on the path because he knows that you can take it following your purpose. Doing what God wants you to do is not easy. I don’t want to be doing what I’m doing. Like quite frankly, I don’t want to. I had a very good job. As a sales engineer. I was very good at it. If I was working on an opportunity to work for Amazon, I would have made 4443 400 grand a year. I didn’t do it, I did not need to do shit. I could have just stopped it there. And just continue doing it for 20 years, buy a bunch more houses and just retire at 60 with a bunch of equity with a bunch of houses everywhere and just I’m out. No, instead I refinanced my house. Instead, I cashed out all my investment, and I quit my job. And I started a company because that’s what I was told to do. In order for me to produce the content I do every day. I need to be able to make a living and not my old job. There’s no way I could talk the way I could talk. I can talk right now. Like I’m not employable anymore.

Joe Quattrone 14:05
But there’s a little bit of freedom in that. No, like it’s a little bit. It feels like more than a lot of it.

Nico Lagan 14:11
Yeah, absolutely. It’s, you know, I don’t do as much as last year has been hard. Because it’s challenging men starting a business from the get go a year ago, I did not know. I had no idea what I was going to do. I just knew I needed a year. I knew I needed the time I bought my time. That’s all I did. When I quit my job. On September 15. Last year, we bought an RV and we bought a truck to pull the Travel Trailer. I mean, we packed all of our stuff a week after September 15 When we didn’t even know if we could cross the border. We didn’t even know if they would let us in because of our vaccination status. Because of the news that was telling us we couldn’t come through because in Canada we weren’t allowed to, I wasn’t able to move anywhere. I couldn’t leave the country for a year now. If I wasn’t allowed, we risked it and the border agent could give a crap about it. He’s just how are you going to support yourself? I’m like, bro, I’m good. Okay, bye. Bye, have fun, enjoy the US. And so we didn’t know I really banked everything on it. But all I knew was I needed time to develop what I’m doing right now.

Joe Quattrone 15:23
And when you speak about what you’re doing right now, you mentioned something about five virtues that people need to possess, or young men need to possess. Can you give that to our audience right now so they can kind of get hip to this real quick?

Nico Lagan 15:37
Yeah, and it’s interesting, let me just say that they don’t necessarily come from me. I was challenged. I’m a big stoicism fan. So their virtue is something I’m very strong on and I was in Austin, Texas at the gym record. My girlfriend had like 10 grand of equipment recording me working out at the gym. And there’s a young man that showed up. He’s like, Hey, bro, what are you doing? Like? It doesn’t look like a cell phone. There’s a difference between somebody recording you with this and with a massive gimbaled camcorder. So we started talking. I don’t know if you know the guys from the school of hard knocks. Like they’re everywhere. They’re one of the biggest, they’re freaking massive like they started really the street interview talking about money. They interview people about this. Turns out the main guys are right there. We started talking and recorded a bunch of stuff together. We did a bunch of podcasts. And at one point, he’s like, Hey, bro, we, you need to talk, we need to do a YouTube video. And I want you to tell me what the five things every young man should know. I’m like, Man, screw you. I don’t know that right now. We were meeting a couple of days after and that night I just woke up in the middle of the night. I wake up at around three o’clock in the morning every day. So I just got up and I started writing and before I knew it, I had the five virtues of a good man. So but there’s a stoic principle if you follow stoicism. I just rebranded them so that it makes sense in today’s world, but the first one is courage. The second one is being a protector. Third is being a provider. Fourth is temperance. And fifth is faith. Now we’re in there is my favorite, which is patience. How can patients not make the list? Well, listen, patience, patience scattered a little bit. Temperance is a virtue. Patience is a skill you acquire over time because I don’t think I don’t think patience is possible. I don’t think anybody can really be patient. I think somebody can try to be because somebody can build up to it and get better at it. But I don’t think it’s possible. And temperance to me takes more than just patience. Patience is part of temperance. Plus, I think temperance has a nice ring to it, too. Yeah,

17:56
yes. Yeah.

Nico Lagan 17:57
I’m more intelligent.

Joe Quattrone 17:59
James, a big stoicism guy. I know he’s out there reading Ryan Holiday books and stuff like that. JM What are your

JM Guthrie 18:05
daily stoic? It’s the how, how often that? That one little verse on a daily basis hits on something that’s so clearly part of what’s going on in my life that day. And it boggles my mind. And I do it, you know, I go through it every year, and it happens over and over. So I’m a big subscriber to that. I think one of the questions I have for you as a guy who clearly markets himself as a masculine, has these five virtues.

Nico Lagan 18:33
Do you mean market myself? Are you trying to say I’m not?

JM Guthrie 18:37
Yeah, no. Okay. So masculine who’s branded so masculine, who clearly would kick my ass if we were in the same room and I said something that was not probably what you wanted to hear?

Nico Lagan 18:47
No, I wouldn’t . I would never do that. Okay.

Joe Quattrone 18:50
He’s very temperate. Very

JM Guthrie 18:53
challenging. Yeah, I wouldn’t challenge it. I’m curious, like your thoughts in the world today, as masculinity is being challenged by this idea of vulnerability, right. So in history, and a lot of the philosophy even that you spoke of, but certainly as you look at what were powerful masculine men, over the last hundreds of years, being vulnerable is not part of the story. Right. Being stoic Sure. Being the provider. Yes. Being the builder, yes. But today, and it even sounds like in some of the things you’ve mentioned today, vulnerability has become part of being masculine too. What would you say to that?

Nico Lagan 19:35
It’s the way you look at vulnerability is when and where. So the best way I can explain it is that 99.9% of the time a man needs to be stoic, in order to allow his wife to be feminine, but he needs to be vulnerable with her in exchange, because women want that connection. The problem that we see today is that men have no clue control. And that’s why Temperance is so important because you either control your emotions or they control you, there’s two states. And those are your choices. But when it comes to vulnerability, there’s one safe space in the world that exists, and it’s not a hole. So when I say a man should be a provider, it’s more than just making money. It’s providing a space building, as you so said, building a space where your wife and your kids feel secure. Because you have to state your mind again, you are either surviving, which all you think about is how, where am I going to get my next meal? How am I going to pay for this, and a state of Growth? If you never allow it, if your family is always in a state of survival, they will never grow. So as a man, you’re supposed to provide that, that kind of that safe space for them to grow. As soon as you step through that front door, you need to be responsible for your emotions, you need to have them under control. But there’s a time and place for you to be vulnerable. And normally, it’s towards your kids and your wife. There’s a fine line between being emotional. And being stoic. You don’t want to be a rock either, because you’ll never be able to create bonds with anybody, but I’m vulnerable with some of my friends. Like I got to Burroughs that they know me, in and out. I am vulnerable with those guys. But it’s not in public. It’s when the time is right, and it’s up to us to figure that out. Where

JM Guthrie 21:24
Does the huddle? Where does that so you mentioned being vulnerable at home with your kids and your wife? And then not obviously outside of the house, you have to show that strength and ultimately, the Temperance to not have your emotions controlling you. When does the bridge have been at somebody who has the gap? If you’re looking at somebody who’s a dad of three who has got, you know, two sons that clearly are looking to me for that example? Where does the bridge happen from being that vulnerable person with them at home to trying to teach them compassion and empathy and some ability to relate and be in control of their own emotions to being this stronger, masculine figure outside of the house? Where did that Where did your

Nico Lagan 22:09
responsibility Yeah, this, I think, is the mistake that we make today. Because if you look at a man and a woman, if you look at a mother and a father, we complement each other. So study shows that in a household where the woman does not feel safe, she is not a good mother, because mothers are based on emotion. Emotional Intelligence is supposed to be taught by the woman, you can look at some of the toughest men that ever lived, you look at the the not the Athenians, but the Spartans, the A Gogi, which is the rites of passages that they would go through did not start until they were seven or eight years old. But until then, the boys would spend most of their time with their mother. Because it is looked at today, like I’m a prime example of that. I’m raised by a single mother, my dad wasn’t even when I was younger, my dad wasn’t really present. So my mother did most of the job. What happens when you’re trying to multitask? When you’re trying to be both, both of them are gonna get screwed up. To this day, I struggle with relationships with Disney. Now, it’s very conscious, and it’s been conscious for a very long time. And it’s something that I need to work on. I’m not saying this as an excuse. I’m just saying, those are the cards that were dealt, I’m dealing with them. But at the same time, my mother never taught me that I look at my sister, that’s a year and a half younger than me, she has the same problem as me except she doesn’t see it. But you look at the type of relationship that she’s had her whole life. She wants, she doesn’t want kids. And two, she’s never been affectionate. I have never seen my sister and she’s 40. Now, I’ve never seen her affectionate with somebody, my mother and like in my family, we don’t even know how to hug really yet. I’ve given that I’m a big fan of free hugs. I’ve given maybe 5000 hugs to complete strangers all across the US all across Canada. So it’s something I’m working towards, but it’s supposed to come from the feminine energy. You’re supposed to be more than the logical side. You’re supposed to care for your children. Don’t get me wrong. I’m not saying you’re not supposed to be kind and compassionate with your children. But if you look at masculine and feminine energy, it’s more of a feminine trait.

Joe Quattrone 24:20
So real quick, though, so we got masculine energy, we’ve got feminine energy, it seems to me just kind of looking at it from a distance and kind of up close and personal. I’m married with kids. I’ve got a wife of 12 years now. We’ve been together for almost two decades. Congratulations

Nico Lagan 24:34
Sorry, but congratulations. Those are the stories I love to hear. I love Thank you.

Joe Quattrone 24:39
But one thing that I’m noticing a little bit is that there’s a lot of competition between the energies and a lot of competition between the sexes. Why is it? It seems like everybody’s angling towards masculinity and they almost want it because I see a lot of women that appear masculine based on how you know how they’re getting in. This society, they’re kind of wanting to compete with the men for certain types of positions and stuff like that. Is that really healthy for society? Or should we have more specific roles that complement each other like it used to back in the day? And how do we provide that? How do we get back to that without like setting people back? Because I know there’s going to also be that narrative around. Well, we just earned all these rights. I don’t want to give them back now.

Nico Lagan 25:24
That’s a brilliant question. That’s a question I’m faced with everyday. And at the end, I’m blaming both men and women because fathers are teaching that to their, to their daughters as much as mothers are. But we society is telling daughters that they don’t need men. Our daughters are being told from a young age that you do not need a man to be happy, you do not need a man to take care of you, you do not need men to be around you. Yet, the society in which we live was built by men, and is still maintained. Masculinity is the most powerful force. And on this planet, we have the potential to build, and to destroy, it’s always us that message that build everything, and that’s going to destroy it. But we do it. Look at the society in which we live today. Nature’s brutal, it’s hard to live in nature. So as men, we decided that we’re going to build a society so that our kids and our wives can be more secure, where we can provide for them. But we’re not explaining that we’re not explaining this to our daughters anymore. And a guy I met this year, Justin Garcia calls it the aquarium effect. So we live in a society for so long, we’re so far detached from the maintenance, from when it was built, and the maintenance of it, that we’re like those little fishies in a tank. And we’re just like, we don’t realize that there’s somebody behind the scene that’s keeping the water clean, that’s making sure the pH level is good, that’s feeding us, that’s taking care of all of our little needs. And we’re so arrogant, that we don’t even realize that there’s people behind the scene. Like right now, people don’t even understand that 95% of the 20 most dangerous jobs are done by men. Is it because women can do it? No, because they don’t want to know, but there’s no woman out there. That’s, I want to be able to work in the oil fields. Of course not nobody wants to do those jobs. Men do it because we can, we’re stupid enough to do it. And it pays. It’s a risk. So we just need to go back to a point where we explain to our daughters that she needs a man. No, because I don’t think men and women need each other to exist. I can live without a woman for the rest of my life, and it’s gonna be fine. But we do complement each other we’re supposed to go where two sides of the same coin. But Yin and Yang do the same thing. We think it polarizes each other.

Joe Quattrone 27:54
I think it’s pretty prevalent in society. And it comes from men too, when I see what’s happening in pop culture around sports right now, right? There’s no such thing. There’s no such thing as a team anymore. So back in my day, when I was a kid, you know, we had favorite players, but we also like, really revered the idea of teamwork and coaches that were, you know, the legendary coaches like John Wooden, and in my backyard, it was Joe Gibbs of the Washington Redskins, or, you know, there’s several various different like John Thompson of the Georgetown Hoyas, or whatever. Nowadays, I don’t have a favorite team. I like Lebron James. I don’t have a favorite team. I like Tyreke. Hill, I don’t have a favorite team. I like XYZ. Is there an overarching absence of leadership in general? Because when I see the competition between the sexes, it’s like, I just want the power. I don’t care about all the trimmings that go along with the household and all this other kind of stuff. Like or do you feel like we as a society are lacking leadership overall.

Nico Lagan 28:55
I love the word leadership. I absolutely love it because men are supposed to lead. Men are born leaders. But we have this misconception of what leadership is. We think leadership, we think CEO of a company that’s running 1000s of people. We don’t understand that leadership is as small as leading your family. It says it’s as small as being somebody that’s dependable in your community, leading by example. One thing you know what I’ve learned over the past years of going from just a few 1000 followers to more than 100,000 people look at what’s your what I’m doing, but they don’t talk they don’t like they don’t comment, because they don’t want people to know that they agree with what I’m saying. But you know how many times I’ve got messages in the backend to just say, Hey, bro, what you’re doing is amazing. So just me doing what I’m doing having the balls to say, You know what, screw this noise. I’m gonna say something because I’m supposed to say it. Just leading by example, you enable others to do the same.

Joe Quattrone 29:59
When that Really important. Another thing was the ship at the end of it. Right? So leadership vacuum, we acknowledge that. But are we getting and this is where I want to tie it back to alcohol a little bit because I feel like a good leader of a household doesn’t resort to the bottle when they’re stressed out. But is there also a void of fellowship amongst men like a place a safe space that men can go to talk without alcohol being involved? That, you know, they can feel some sort of camaraderie or something like that? Should we try to amp that up as a society? You know, this sober living? Yes. But with other men in fellowship with you?

Nico Lagan 30:39
Million Dollar, I don’t think I could shake my head more than I was doing it. I was trying not to hit my microphone.

Joe Quattrone 30:46
Well, that’s your number one thing that all of us, all of us boys on this call, we don’t drink. We’d love each other anytime we get a chance to be getting on this podcast once a week or three times a week with these guys as my fellowship, you know, love

Nico Lagan 30:57
it. But you’re 100% you know how I was when I became manly. When I discovered martial arts. When I was in my early 20s, I had been hitting the gym. I’m like, Man, my body is important. And I started to be a victim. My whole teenage years, I was a victim. I couldn’t fight. I knew it. I was bullied when I was younger. And it’s when I stepped into a gym. And I started to train with killers. I started to understand that those guys are so nice. You know how many conversations we’ve had on the mat, bloody, sweaty, scraped, just completely exhausted, just sitting, barely able to sit. And you just start talking. Just start talking. How many times have we gone out to watch fights? It’s not about drinking. It’s just about a bunch of boys that like fighting, that are sitting in the same place just being together. But today, we’ve removed even the Boy Scouts is not even exclusive to men anymore. How? How ridiculous is that? That we have no institution right now that is 100% men. There’s none. You become a Mason, maybe you could become a Mason, maybe a Mason. And it only it depends on your traditional one Are you the new type of Mason that allows the women so even Masonry is not 100% women and a not 100% of

Joe Quattrone 32:15
men. And then you got to get into all that devil worshiping which I can’t espouse.

Nico Lagan 32:19
But you know, at the end of the day, this is the problem. It’s just we’re so far down the rabbit hole that we don’t even understand the simple things that men need to be surrounded by other men so that they can learn what it is to become a good man. rites of passages I’ve been forever for I’ve been there for probably 60,000 years. Look at every single culture out there there are rites of passage where more mature men take younger boys and teach them what it is to become a man. There’s three different types of rites of passage that men should have. We have 00 we have none in their society. Even though like I said, The Boy Scouts are gone. And how awesome are the Boy Scouts? When you just think about it , a bunch of older men take younger boys in the woods to show them survival skills to chill around a fire and have them do it. How amazing is that? I’ll

Joe Quattrone 33:18
never forget that. One of the things that got me hooked into Game of Thrones back in the day, see Episode One, when the main kind of archetypal figure is the father of the house of the wolf. I don’t remember the name of them and the Stark family. He made sure that when they caught the thief, he brought his boys out to the block to show them cutting his head off because they were like, No, it’s our land, it’s our job, you have to watch this because it’s going to be your job one day, essentially. And that’s, there’s no more of that. Like there’s at least in modern day society, it doesn’t seem like there’s as many wives out there expecting their husbands to go out and be masculine in that way with the next of kin. Which, you know, maybe is missing in society a little bit like not learning how to be a man from a met another man is, you know, maybe we’re a little bereft of that 33

Nico Lagan 34:10
to 40%, depending on the studies you’re looking at are the amount of boys that are raised in other photos in the household. So when I was young 26 When it happened to me 27 years ago, I was an exception. Now it’s the norm. Like we’re talking 33 to 40. That’s, that’s insane. That’s absolutely insane. And,

Joe Quattrone 34:34
but what I’m saying is even so, that’s statistically proven, right? But even the men that do grow up as present fathers in their household are not expected to be as manly as our fathers and our grandfathers generations of men, right? So women are expected to be as feminine as their mothers and grandmothers were either that we’re all kind of it’s almost like men and women are becoming more homogenous is just like a goal. Oh genderless parent types.

Nico Lagan 35:01
That’s the goal. The goal is to meet somewhere in the middle because we’re all the same. Yet if you look at the definition of the same, that means we’re I mean, the same means identical. And we’re not men and women couldn’t be any different. So we’re not the same. We are not the same at all. It’s obviously not working. It is obviously not working. Look at the relationships up today. To a point where now you have guys like the passport bros, you’ve heard of those guys are

Joe Quattrone 35:27
the ones that go overseas to find their wife. Yeah. And what I

Nico Lagan 35:31
I find them funny about those guys. I understand the sentiment. I feel bad for young men today, because it’s extremely dangerous for a man to get married today. Like you need to be extremely careful who you choose, which is not necessarily a bad thing, but it is the reality. But you have the passport, girls are like, Hey, I’m gonna go to I’m gonna go to the Philippines or I’m gonna go to the Eastern European bloc to get me a woman, bro. You’re not a man. Right? Do you think my girlfriend would accept my girlfriend as a first born Italian immigrant? Her parents have been together for 45 years and her father is a man. Her mother is a woman. There’s no, there’s no denying it. They don’t play each other’s roles. They know what they’re supposed to be doing. Do you honestly think that if I wasn’t manly, my girlfriend would be here. Any woman in the past 20 years that I’ve dated, and I’ve dated anything from doctors, to professors from women that are extremely educated, that normally will be more masculine, every single one of them love the fact that I’m 210 pounds of muscle, and I can kill somebody with my hands, every single one of them. Because they want to feel protected. They’re not going to admit to it. But being able to walk around at three o’clock in the morning, knowing that I’ll take a bullet for them knowing that I’ll do what needs to be done to defend them without questioning if it’s something that they want.

Joe Quattrone 36:52
I just marked that clip for social media distribution. So killing hands might be the thing. Real quick to Joe. Let

Kary Youman 36:59
I just ask. I wanted to ask you this earlier. Nikko. I think it’s a good segue. I think we live in a society today specifically for men, there’s a lot of stress, there’s a lot of pressure, you look at the suicides, you look at the mass shootings, it’s generally it’s generally males. And I’m just curious, like what’s shifted for you, man? Like there’s still a lot of guys out there who would literally ruin their entire lives because someone flick them off, you know what I mean? So like, what, what was that shift for you? That kind of got you to a point where, like, you could kind of take a breath and say, You know what, it’s not worth it. And I know you mentioned martial arts. I know martial arts have really made an impact in my life. I’m just curious. What was that for you, man?

Nico Lagan 37:35
12 years ago, I discovered Buddhism. That’s what I did. I became Christian over the years, especially over the past year, but I’ve been spiritual for a very long time. Like it started a really long time ago. But it started with Buddhism. And my mother eventually remarried and the guy that became my stepfather is one of the greatest men I’ve ever met. And he went, he got cancer. I couldn’t, it didn’t make any sense to me, like ex-military, super healthy, got esophagus cancer, battled cancer for five years, like radiation and chemotherapy, basically every month for five years. And he is what it is. He was a great man. But the thing is, though, when he died, I couldn’t explain it because they didn’t make sense to me. Like, how can a guy like that die? And one of my buddies gave me a Buddhist book, and I started reading and it’s just the middle way they talk about this, and Buddhism all the time to try to find the middle way to try to understand that you don’t control much. All you control really is your emotions, your actions and your reactions. Everything else doesn’t, is out of your control. Whatever people force on you, is not up to you. You do not choose most of the situations in which you’re going to find yourself. But you do have 100% control on how you’re going to react to them. And you know, people believe that reaction is for most people, at least I should say this reactions are something that’s unconscious, you simply react to a situation yet through meditation through hypnosis, self hypnosis, I have built a pathway between my conscious mind and my unconscious mind by repeating the same thing over and over again, similar to what marketing does on commercials on TV. Just keep on repeating the same thing to yourself through meditation and self hypnosis, and you’ll see that you start anchoring some things in your mind. And this is how it started is really just in Buddhism when I started meditating about 12 years ago, it really really like to this day I meditate ever after every workout, because I do not want to reenter the world pumped with testosterone hyper, because I know what the lack of patients that I have as a you and being like, this is one of the reasons I don’t drink. I’ll have a drink with a cigar when I really feel like it but getting drunk I think my girlfriend’s known me for four years. She’s never seen me tipsy and I drink maybe once a month like super nice. I love cigars so nice they smoke cigars. We drink but I’m not a good drunk. I’m terribly drunk. It has ruined my life for almost 20 years. Because I’m such a bad drunk I have a really big anger problem. So it’s

Joe Quattrone 40:29
A good segue into the final segment that we typically like to do on the show is called products and practices. So knowing that you only like to drink when you have a cigar in your mouth what what do you do to quell temptation the rest of the time like how it is it just be you can call upon it and summon it based on meditations and in avoid the bottle because you just know what the ramifications of that are, are there? Are there certain products and practices that you utilize to stay as clear headed and level headed as possible.

Nico Lagan 41:01
I’ve made peace with the fuck years ago that any state anytime you change your state of consciousness could be anything from caffeine to getting a high should be for a reason. It should be a conscious choice. Why am I taking a substance that is altering my state of mind? It needs to be mindful, you need to have an answer for every time as you said earlier. I have drank alcohol for so long because I was coping with something I did not want to deal with. Same thing for drugs. Now I will allow myself to have a drink every now and then just because it’s like a reward in matches with the cigar but it is always 100% conscious. I treat my food the same way. I cheated like tonight is a cheat night. I haven’t eaten right now since about seven o’clock last night. I’m a big fan of intermittent fasting. So I’ve been fasting for about 20 hours. My girlfriend’s at the store picking up some pepperoni. So we can put on the pizza and I’m gonna have nachos, chocolate cake and pizza. That’s what I’m having. As soon as we’re done, bro, I’m gonna gain 10 pounds.

Joe Quattrone 42:14
I’m on 25 hours, 25 and a half hours right now fasting is three meals. So

Nico Lagan 42:19
amazing for your mind, right? But it is, every time I put something in my body, I want it. I make sure I do it consciously, no matter what it is.

Joe Quattrone 42:29
So that reminds me of a question that I asked people more often than when people are struggling with like, you know, existential questions of like, why is this happening? Why are the bad people dying? While I mean? Why do good people die? All that kind of stuff? You gotta ask yourself, “Does God put you here so you can be happy?” And if you sit there and think about that long enough, you start to realize, probably not. And then that starts to explain why some things happen in your life. It’s really we’re here for a reason. And that’s to learn things. We’re here to try to live in and ladder up to the glory of God and the grace of God. And that’s hard to do if you don’t learn lessons about things in life and lessons are hard, you know, so. But I really appreciate you coming on the pod and I love the answers that you’ve provided here. Any parting gifts for the crew, anything you got working on right now that you want to tune our audience into anything going on your social media handles that you want to let them know about? Before

Nico Lagan 43:22
I do, I just want to carry on to what you said their pain and suffering are the greatest of teachers. We do not allow herself to feel any more, we don’t allow herself to hurt. If you’re hurting, meditate on it, let it be. They ask something to teach you pain and suffering or the greatest of teachers. Nobody changes because they’re comfortable. You only change when you hit rock bottom and doing the same thing over and over again is no longer an option. This is where you change and the reason I love Christianity so much is as you read the Bible, you will understand that pain and suffering are needed. How are men built through trials and suffering so instead of seeing it as a punishment, see it as a thought as a place of growth. There’s a story I heard years ago where this man is God for patients, God answers him to say I cannot give you patience, but I can put you in a situation that will force you to become patient. So just a little two cent one one other of my many rants on the subject

Joe Quattrone 44:25
I love it and back to fasting you know like God sometimes from what I’ve heard throughout the Bible, it’s you unlock deeper levels of connection with God when you’re fasted. So, you know, what are you doing when you’re fasting? You’re withholding you’re making your life more painful so that you can have a different level of consciousness or clarity when you talk to the Father. So let’s

Nico Lagan 44:44
not even say how good it is for your body. How much of a break you’re giving to your body. how unhealthy it is to be able to go fast like I do faster three to five days sometimes. So that’s a challenge. That’s a different story. But yeah,

Joe Quattrone 44:58
Nico Where can our audience find you obviously the Nico Lagen show I should say but we’re on social media can they find you?

Nico Lagan 45:06
Everywhere. I post on probably eight different platforms. They lie @RealNicoLagen everywhere if you don’t know just NicoLagan.com. All my socials are there. Gotcha all the headed friends guys you’ll find me somewhere.

Kary Youman 45:22
It’s been real Nikko appreciate your realness, man. Yeah,

Nico Lagan 45:25
That’s all I got.